That's one writer whose work I simply can't read because she's obviously writing herself in House's role as the abused child and her own parent(s) as House's father (or should I say Father?). The characters aren't recognizable to me as the those from the show, especially John House. She's writing about herself, not about House. If other people like that then that's great, and if it helps her somehow that's even better. I just don't want to read it.

And I know how you feel, wondering what the deal is when you dislike her work, but other people like hers and your own both quite well. I feel exactly the same way about another author, whose stuff I find basically unreadable because I see it as so out of character and sappy. Yet someone else -- a writer I totally respect -- loves that person's work, and also seems to enjoy mine, and I ... scratch my head, sigh, and carry on. I feel the same way as blackmare and Alex about this author's work--trying to read even two chapters sweeps me away on giant waves of "Meh." But I don't want to go on critiquing one author, and it's clear that there are plenty of fans that feel differently (Yay for fandom heterogeneity!) I'm more interested in the why's of what we like. Definitely in this fandom, I've seen what I call "writer's writers"--people who utilize language and dramatic development so skillfully that it takes other (serious) writers' breaths away. I may not care for the pairing (if any) or the plot, but I could just go on reading their stuff forever, because it's like a pleasure cruise for my brain. On the other end of the spectrum, there are writers that don't appeal to me, who I feel are at best mediocre and whose characters don't particularly sound like House or any of the rest of the cast--but all the author has to do is "plug and play" and take care to hit the buttons that appeal to mass audience. For example, on ff.net, take a little House/Cam, add in emo wangst on her part, incredible OOC sensitivity on his, and voila! Sit back and watch the reviews roll in! Not that the authors don't deserve reviews--more power to 'em, I say. It's just interesting how responses vary to different writing styles, and how some authors who I totally respect can't get even a modicum of acclaim on certain sites.

There are a lot of fics that other people like and respect that just don't appeal to me. Like ... and not to pick on anyone in particular here, but I'm gonna, kind of ... those related to the torture fic genre. For me, it's not an issue with the violence, it's just that I'm interested in the characters as they are in canon, not as they are in extremes -- and I fully understand that people like seeing how the characters react in extreme situations, it's just not my thing. So while I fully can admire the stuff that the black cigarette collective is doing now, for instance -- and think it's fine writing, what I've read of it -- I just have absolutely no interest in the central core concept of the fic. But I also realize that's my issue and not theirs. (Heck, my tastes are probably odd anyway. "Gone With the Wind?" I will never understand why that movie is considered a classic.) I know I've also written stuff that doesn't appeal to certain readers. I don't think there's any such thing as a story with universal appeal. There are fics that have a wider appeal, but it's a universal invariant that tastes vary.

I'm more interested in the why's of what we like. Everyone has a different emotional reaction to certain things, we all have characters we find more or less attractive, we perceive them differently & that effects whether we consider someone's writing IC or OOC. We have different senses of humor :twisted: . We also have different tolerances to spelling or grammar mistakes :lol: I find what I want to read &/or enjoy varies even with what mood I'm in, so I'm not sure we'll ever get a real answer to that except on a very, very personal basis. There are fics in the Hall of Fame which are undeniably well-written - doesn't mean I necessarily like them or have any desire to ever read them again, though I'm sure others do & will. ETA - Namaste, I'm with you on both the collective fic & Gone with the Wind ;D

Oh noes! One of my heroes doesn't care for my latest project! I'm gonna binge on Rocky Road ice cream now and then play Evanescence really loud while I carve interesting patterns into my arms with a kitchen knife! Um ... or not. Hee! Namaste, you're awesome. We don't mind if you pick on us a little. I'm actually surprised that you read any of the Aftershocks stuff. At least in this part the violence is over with (she said, for the benefit of anyone who doesn't know and is wondering). Most of the time, I can't abide the torturous stuff either. It's only the Dog and the Sheep who can really pull me into those kinds of stories -- cringing all the way, yet I follow. There's just something about Nightdog's ficverses in particular that seems to draw me in very deeply in spite of myself. There are some stories of hers that she knows I will never read, though, because they're too disturbing for me. I like my House-ficcing friends because they're mature enough that we can say to one another, "Sorry, I'm going to take a pass on this story of yours because it's just not to my taste" and we don't get offended over that. Someday, perhaps I'll be skilled enough to do what you can do -- to take what should be mundane and transform it, giving it such depth and unexpected beauty. I love that kind of work. I hope to write some of it in the future.

aenissesthai wrote: I think that one should leave gentle, specific critique, then sit back and see what the response is. . .. That sounds ideal. But unlike the "friend to tea" analogy, I don't believe that we have to tiptoe around those who might possibly pitch an emo fit when receiving critique. I'm sorry if I was vague. I admit I read fanfic for relaxation, and sometimes I don't really mind if some element doesn't seem quite right (to me anyway) in the spirit of just enjoying the whole story. I agree though that where there is sensible critique to be given, one is not helping by... not helping! As with art, there are a million different visions of an idea. Picasso's style is not Renoir's, and Renoir's is not Leonardo's. Sometimes I worry that I am just not "getting" a particular author's vision, though others love it, and I'll just move on.

Another thing I just thought of is that there's a story I really like on ff.net, but the author writes dialogue in a way that the actions following each quote are performed by the other character, if you get what I mean. It gives me a headache trying to figure out who's saying what, and I did say that and she responded, but it hasn't improved. I can look over minor grammar mistakes here and there, but the way she's setting it up is making me avoid the story, which is unfortunate, because it is edited, it's just arranged in such a confusing way. It drives me crazy when 'its' and 'it's' are confused, but I can look over it if the rest of the story is good.

But she updates often, writes long stories, and writes a lot of angsty mostly IC emotion - all things I really go for. This interests me--I think prolific authors often catch fandom's attention simply because their names are in the public eye. I can't comment on this particular author, but I know of several people with long WiPs that draw folk in because there's always more coming down the pike. I've known this to be true with my own WiPs, as well. "Leave 'em wanting more," as the saying goes. People like cliffhangers. Still, it always astounds me when people say, "Her stuff is pretty OOC but I like it anyway." Um, what? For me, IC description and action is THE defining feature of a good story. (Well, that and proper apostrophe usage.) I read a very good analogy once: it's okay to make your character do stuff that canon says they would never do, as long as you show them arriving at that point. Character A despises broccoli and would never eat it? Show the gradual steps as he overcomes his aversion. It can't be just "Eat broccoli or die in a fire!" There has to be a progression, a lessening of Character A's hatred, reasons for the change. When he finally does eat broccoli, we have to believe it. That's why so many torture fics don't work for me, much as Namaste pointed out. The believability is so rarely established for me. The one where Wilson goes missing for fourteen months--my apologies, both title and author escape me for the moment--that story managed to convince me, barely. I read it, though I kept sort of looking up in skepticism now and again. When the original "Contract" story was up for Hall of Fame discussion, I tried to read it more than once and it was the believability issue that kept kicking me out. It was too abrupt, to my way of thinking. That's one of the hardest things to write, I think. And sometimes you can establish believability in a drabble. Sometimes it takes a novel.

The one where Wilson goes missing for fourteen months--my apologies, both title and author escape me for the moment- I guess that would be The Body Found by Fourteen Candles - one of my favourites. Although I have a torture!fic squick, I have no objection to exploring characters in extreme situations - one of the things I love about The Body Found is how IC I think House & Wilson manage to stay through it all. What I can't stomach, not even briefly, is kid!fic. And part of me is really sorry about this, as I know there are several highly-regarded much-praised very-well-written kid!fic universes out there. (And I know what they are, too, I don't need recs!) But I just can't deal with them! Even if I love other stuff by the same author - I've tried and rarely get beyond a screen of text. I don't expect any sympathy for this! - but would be interested to see if anyone else has any similar such feeling.

I think I am pretty intergenre-ational. I don't have a particular genre that totally tiddles my winks. I don't mind a bit of an overly sappy story, a gritty realism story, Cameron doing House, fill in the gaops realism stories like Sy's or way out there stories set in futuristic worlds. ETA - and yes: It took me while, but I'm okay with good kid fics now. I think ff is a lot of different things to a lot of different people. For example I like some of an author's stories and not others in exactly the same way I like some directors movies and not others - and in exactly the same way you don't generally find me watching action movies. I don't condemn the genre because some people like it. I think Namaste put it best when she said torture fics just aren't 'my cup of tea'. I'm pretty good on the old suspension of disbelief, but I do draw the line at high school stories and has anyone ever considered, from a woman's point of view, what actually living with House would be like? Chew on that Hammerites! But people - on a serious note. Can we try to stay away from talking about specific authors here. We are a disparate bunch of people with likes and dislikes, and talents - and everyone is allowed to have an opinion on other peoples' stuff - and people know each other and understand there is a bit of a back and forth banter between the 'poke House with sticks' people and the 'tube of lube' people and the 'House/Cameron + kittens' lot. And that's okay - if you know each other, know the person is going to be okay with it and want to tease, ie House and Wilson - that's fine. But I think the recent 'kerfuffle' told us something as a whole. I don't mind people talking about my stuff - damn that unexpected granny! But there are others who are a bit less... egotistical... shall we say. The amazing thing I have noticed about ff is that it can make someone who has never written before pick up a pen and start writing. Not pick up a gun - but a pen. And considering the number of guns floating around that's a good thing because all the biros have gone to that Douglas Adams Biro world. Now unless they start writing about eating peoples' babies (that's why we have House_MST) I think we should encourage whatever genre/weird pairing/etc. It may not be your cup of tea, but remember - it is keeping these people off the streets. If it wasn't for fan fiction I'd be running around outside right now armed with an Uzi - just like Alan Rickman in Die Hard, but without the sex appeal. So while anything written by me is fair game (and I know that was being used as an example and that is cool), can we try to keep posts on an even keel and keep Uzied-up ff authors off the streets and be a little more general because you never know which author might be reading this - and they could live just around the corner from you. Remember, no matter how awful it is - someone has been brave enough to post/inflict the world with their stuff - although some ff authors are like bad poets. No matter how many times you tell them to bugger off they keep coming back like a bouncy ball. And otherwise I'll get Doctor Scruffy to set Poeia on you and you'll be mauled by a small green Macaw (that's a parrot type looking thing by the way). Which doesn't sound very scary does it? See - this is why I suck at being a moderator. I need to take lessons from the Soviet Union. Although apparently President Kennedy was once mauled by a bunny rabbit..? And after all it is always more fun and productive to discuss why you, personally, don't like certain genres, etc. That's the stuff that is very handy for writers. Although that raises another question. I've always thought of ff as a very selfish medium. Do writers write for their audience or do they write for themselves? And also - do you think that who you are in real life affects how you - as a reader - see ff. I'll use the Contract. I have had the luck to be exposed to a lot of real life nastyness, but imagine if you were ten and the world seemed nice and happy and someone started telling you about nasty stuff - you just wouldn't believe it. And some people's jaws have dropped at the pics floating on my screen saver. So the scenario I wrote - to me - isn't all that out there. But nasty v nice aside - how do people think their different world view effects what and how they react to what they read. Come on House/Foreman people - tell me why you think it is plausible why they could actually shag.

Off topic, but I couldn't resist: If it wasn't for fan fiction I'd be running around outside right now armed with an Uzi. Which does sound scarier than being mauled by a small green Macaw...

Don't get the big P started on birds. You just don't go calling a Macaw a Parrot around her. She can be very emphatic. She knows her birds. But where were we - kid fic! I know peoples' opinions vary on this, but how much of that is a stretch nowadays and dear lordie be - House with a small child. I'm a bit of a leftie, but whatever your beliefs about stuff are - I find the idea of House looking after a small child quite scary. It reminds me of this English dude called Gerry Durrell and his family moved to some small Spanish type island, odd writing people would pop over for long extended stays, he kept snakes in the bath and his older brother set up the veranda as a shooting range - and no one blinked an eye lid. When they had invited too many odd literary guests to stay: they just moved. When they didn't want lots of odd literary guests over: they moved again. That is sort of what I'd imagine being House's son would be like.

Ah, My Family And Other Animals! God I used to love those books. Word to the analogy, though House wouldn't repeatedly move, would he - after all he's been in the same apartment for 15 years :wink:

Not according to the set/stock footage monkeys.