Season 4 did lose 8 episodes. But 24 episodes later, I think they've caught up what was lost in terms of getting to know the new team and their personal stories. I don't think that another 8 episodes of The Perils of Thirteen or Taub's marital problems would have made me like either of them more. (I'd like to think that if any storyline got short-changed it was finding out more about Chase and Cameron's relationship and why they are together but I don't think we would have got any more on them than we did.)
But why do the new team members have to have the same traits as the old ones? Wouldn't that be repetitive and defeat the purpose of changing the team?
I don't think they should because it would be repetitious and annoying. Having gone through three cast changes on ER, I know that bringing on the bad boy and redeeming him yet again (first Doug Ross then Pratt and then Gates) can get ridiculous.
But what I think is that the new team should have traits different from each other and from House himself. Of the new team, both Thirteen and Taub are similar to Foreman and hence to House and only Kutner was different and now he's gone. If they had kept Henry (ROF) or Amber or even Cole, all of whom were different from the original team, or if they had dropped Foreman while bringing on Thirteen and Taub, there would still have been some variety on the team. The problem with House's team as it currently is is not that we already know about House unlike with the original team but that they all bring out the same thing in House and the DDx sessions. By replacing the team with these specific characters, they limited the kind of interactions House has with his team, just as they limited the variety of emotional interactions House has when they limited them to Cuddy and Wilson. Instead of opening up the show, the changes shut down the possibilities.
The one trait that should have stayed in someone on the team is a sense of ethics because it's a necessary part of medicine and often brings a sense of drama to the situation but most obviously it highlights House's lack of conventional ethics in order to get to the answer,which is something we are supposed to admire in him. None of the current team really cares about ethics, and Wilson and Cuddy won't do because Wilson isn't on the team and Cuddy should be ruthless in putting the hospital first. So now that no one on the team cares really cares about ethics and often not about the patient, how is House any different than everyone else? What makes him special in terms of how he practices medicine? And where is the drama in the DDx sessions? Only in the race against time now.
He was like an adolescent boy rebelling against mommy! Cuddy and daddy! Wilson for having strong armed him into hiring a new team.
House has been rebelling since season 1 and there was very much a mommy and daddy feel to Cuddy and Wilson's interactions with House in previous seasons, especially season 3 during Tritter. And that worked because again, there was the contrast to House, that where he was a rebellious kid delighting in blowing things up, Wilson and Cuddy were the sober adults who tried to figure out how much leeway to give to him. Having used Cuddy as a mommy figure, or maybe babysitter since House had sexual fantasies about her, for four seasons it's hard to move her into being a real love object for House especially when they still need her to function as a mommy the rest of the time. It all feels wrong (to me).
I think it would have worked better if they had given House another boss while Cuddy is his love object. Not because I'm opposed to boss/employee relationships (fingers still crossed on Raising the Bar) but because of who House is and how he functions. Unless they want to change the character into someone else, he needs a mommy/authoritarian figure because he functions by being rebellious and often immature.
I miss Cameron and her ethics because House runs roughshod over everyone else now - including Cuddy - and that's getting very old and repetitive to me. I miss Chase's steadfast belief in House, and I miss that the old team actually liked and cared about him. When House fell over the tripwire, only Foreman was concerned. Taub and Thirteen cared only about not being blamed.
ITA about House running roughshod over everyone now which I also find repetitious now. And about the old team genuinely caring about House. If Taub and Thirteen don't care and Cuddy set the tripwire and didn't care if he got hurt and Wilson sometimes doesn't care, why should I as an audience member care? I take my cue from the people on the show.
I would add that the Survivor arc allowed viewers to pick their own favorites and the eventual winners were saddled with resentment from the get-go.
I think something of that also applies to whoever House's love interest is. The show offered three viable ships for House, four if you count Stacy, and the audience members picked who they thought would be best for him, whether it was based on sexual chemistry, personality matches or what they thought would be good drama. The problem was that except for Stacy, the other ship storylines weren't really wrapped up properly. It was inevitable that those who didn't see their ship happen were going to be disappointed. Even more so given how immature many of the interactions between House and Cuddy were this season which left many with the feeling that "my ship would have been better than that".
But what I think is that the new team should have traits different from each other and from House himself. Of the new team, both Thirteen and Taub are similar to Foreman and hence to House and only Kutner was different and now he's gone. If they had kept Henry (ROF) or Amber or even Cole, all of whom were different from the original team, or if they had dropped Foreman while bringing on Thirteen and Taub, there would still have been some variety on the team. The problem with House's team as it currently is is not that we already know about House unlike with the original team but that they all bring out the same thing in House and the DDx sessions. By replacing the team with these specific characters, they limited the kind of interactions House has with his team, just as they limited the variety of emotional interactions House has when they limited them to Cuddy and Wilson. Instead of opening up the show, the changes shut down the possibilities.
I agree. FT&T are redundant. They're all cynical and they're all jerks. None of them seem to actually like House or appreciate what he teaches them. I miss the soft touch Cameron had and the light that Chase brought. I miss the way both Chase and Cameron actually seemed to appreciate the learning opportunity they had by being in House's presence. I miss the way they could really connect with patients. I've yet to notice 13 or Taub making a true connection with a patient the way Chase did with so many, especially the kids. I can't say they haven't, but if they did, it didn't make an impact on me as a viewer. What made an impact on me was 13's abysmal treatment of the kid with gender issues. She should have been fired. I miss the way Chase and Cameron respected House. I get the vibe from FT&T that they merely tolerate House and 13 comes across like House should be grateful that she's there. House's negativity was one thing that made him unique so having all three fellows exhibit the same cynicism diminishes part of what was special about House in the first place. Three mini-Houses make for yawn-inducing, channel-flipping differentials for me. I also miss the way Chase and Cameron could communicate so much more than the medicine in a differential, for instance when they were arguing about their love life while arguing about treatment options.
At the beginning of Simple Explanation, Taub said Kutner was going to be in late because his dog was sick. Considering Kutner's penchant for sharing everything with his coworkers (Taub, in Let Them Eat Cake "You told us when you renewed your subscription to National Geographic."), the team must have known he had a dog, but we didn't.
I don't think Kutner had a dog. Taub made the up an excuse because he was covering for him for not showing to work on time. He had recently taken credit from Kutner for solving the case and it was his way of returning the favor.
I guess I watch the show on a much more superficial level than most of the HHoW members, because I rarely see these overriding storylines like House rebelling in S4. But I'm sure that casual viewers don't see them, either, and IMO, the show may have sacrificed good and entertaining single episodes to pursue a grand plan. I think you have to have the former, or you'll never get the chance to see the latter come to fruition.
And perhaps I am seeing things and making connections that aren’t there. But I do see House on a pretty steady downward trajectory since the early part of season two. The differences between the Vogler arc and the Tritter arc illustrate House’s gradual fall and the change in his relationships with Wilson and Cuddy quite well. In the Vogler arc, he seemed to be acting more on the basis of his principles than his ego with W/C supporting him, while in the Tritter arc he seemed to be acting more on the basis of his ego than his principles with W/C rescuing him. This season he’s reached a point where neither of them can help him, no matter how much they want to. So far, I’ve absolutely loved the trajectory they’ve taken him on. I don’t find the other two alternatives (he remains the same as he was in season one or that he becomes progressively healthier and happier) very promising, exciting or interesting from a storytelling perspective. .
As regards the "feel" of the show, poor choice of words on my part. What I meant was that they lost the camaraderie and rivalry that had been established among the original characters. As you point out, the new team was hampered by the writers' strike and the overcrowded cast. I would add that the Survivor arc allowed viewers to pick their own favorites and the eventual winners were saddled with resentment from the get-go. Even so, having a complete change really hurt the ddx and any scenes where the team interact, because ALL of them were new, but the show wasn't. If that makes any sense. Had they been introduced one at a time, the continuity wouldn't have been disrupted, and the newbie would have been an old familiar face by the time the next one came along.
I don’t see much differences in camaraderie – or lack of it - among either the old or the new teams. This was the new team’s second year on the show. At the end of the old team’s second year, Foreman stabbed Cameron with an infected needle. Even in the third year Foreman told Chase he doesn’t like him and Chase refused to give him a reference. At least, nobody on the new team has tried to kill each other yet. :) The writing and the acting for Foreman has turned him into such a one dimensional character that it’s hard for me to buy even now that he really cares about either Chase or Cameron. In fact, we saw how suspicious they were when he asked them how they were doing even as late as this season, rightly guessing that he was asking because he needed a favor from them. I saw more camaraderie and chemistry between Taub/ Kutner than I ever have between, say, Chase and Foreman.
.
I see what you mean about the gradual change. I guess the introducing one member at a time idea may have worked but we would have a firing/resignation at the end of seasons three, four and five. House would have to conduct interviews for a new candidate at the start of each season and Cuddy and Wilson would have had to harangue him into doing it every time. It might have become a tad bit repetitive. I don’t know, JMO, of course.
But what I think is that the new team should have traits different from each other and from House himself. Of the new team, both Thirteen and Taub are similar to Foreman and hence to House and only Kutner was different and now he's gone. If they had kept Henry (ROF) or Amber or even Cole, all of whom were different from the original team, or if they had dropped Foreman while bringing on Thirteen and Taub, there would still have been some variety on the team. The problem with House's team as it currently is is not that we already know about House unlike with the original team but that they all bring out the same thing in House and the DDx sessions. By replacing the team with these specific characters, they limited the kind of interactions House has with his team, just as they limited the variety of emotional interactions House has when they limited them to Cuddy and Wilson. Instead of opening up the show, the changes shut down the possibilities.
I don’t think Foreman is anything like House. I don’t think Taub and Foreman are similar. And I actually thought Kutner was like House in many ways. And House does interact with his team. He knows about Taub’s marital problems and predicted that he’d tell his wife about the infidelity. He asked for his perspective on relationships in “The Itch”. He pushed him into realizing that he really wanted his job and that it wasn’t just a poor alternative to the one he had as a plastic surgeon. He pushed Foreman into asserting himself regarding the trial. He stood by 13 during her downward spiral. He helped Foreteen during the drug trial. He gave Kutner a genuine pat on the back for solving the case.
The one trait that should have stayed in someone on the team is a sense of ethics because it's a necessary part of medicine and often brings a sense of drama to the situation but most obviously it highlights House's lack of conventional ethics in order to get to the answer, which is something we are supposed to admire in him. None of the current team really cares about ethics, and Wilson and Cuddy won't do because Wilson isn't on the team and Cuddy should be ruthless in putting the hospital first. So now that no one on the team cares really cares about ethics and often not about the patient, how is House any different than everyone else? What makes him special in terms of how he practices medicine? And where is the drama in the DDx sessions? Only in the race against time now.
Fair enough. I do think the DDX sessions lost their spark after Kutner left. But like I said earlier, his exit wasn’t something that DS could control. I am going to wait and see what he has in store for us regarding a new team member next season.
I think it would have worked better if they had given House another boss while Cuddy is his love object. Not because I'm opposed to boss/employee relationships (fingers still crossed on Raising the Bar) but because of who House is and how he functions. Unless they want to change the character into someone else, he needs a mommy/authoritarian figure because he functions by being rebellious and often immature. .
This would work for a couple of episodes but not beyond that. House is at heart a rebel and it is the risk taking and authority defying aspects of the character that make him and his brand of medicine different and compelling. What would be the point in seeing him being repeatedly disciplined and curtailed? I don’t think he would last for long under a “real” boss and he would only come away from the experience with a new found appreciation for Cuddy. Remember what happened to Foreman at New York Mercy? :)
If Kutner didn't have a dog, when Taub gave that excuse House would have said it was a lie. Between Lucas' investigation and Kutner's penchant for sharing everything with his coworkers, if House didn't know the dog exists he would assume it doesn't.
It annoys me how Taub knocks down everyone's ideas during DDXs because Foreman always did that. Now that Taub is part of the team, that part of Foreman's personality seems to have disappeared.
This thread has been quiet -- almost a whole month since we've found anything to say about S5.
As of Unfaithful, Foreman and Thirteen's affair was between co-workers. Complicated, especially with House as their boss, but acceptable. But in Painless and Big Baby, Foreman was a doctor in a clinical trial and Thirteen was his patient. While they knew each other before their doctor-patient relationship began, they didn't start sleeping together until he was her doctor.
And, while she was definitely qualified for the clinical trial, unlike the Wilson-Grace relationship, there was an element of Foreman getting her into the trial and becoming her doctor because he wanted to sleep with her.
I assume when he told the drug company that he broke protocol, he didn't mention the relationship otherwise he wouldn't just be barred from any future clinical trials, he definitely would have lost his license.
From @GregYaitanes: I have some season five "bloopers" just waitin' to be posted. never seen before! only shown at our wrap party. do i hear 5k?
Need only 359 more to follow the man...Let's get cracking, people!
WOOT! Season Five blooper intro courtesy of Greg Yaitanes.
Wonder if we'll get more, but I'm giggling already.
:lol: Hilarious. CSI:Miami. Horatio Caine :lol:
I hope there is more.
