A Gentle, Polite Reminder It's Tuesday: Chase/Cameron

Word to chipmunk and NightOwl; you took the words right out of my mind - and made them sound a lot better! :) Chase said Cameron was doing it to get House's attention in order to tease the House/Cameron ship, but if it were true, she would have stopped when House didn't care. She didn't, she continued the FWB until she found out that Chase was in danger of getting hurt and then she stopped it immediately. Chase's jealousy was his own issue (possibly because his father had left them and made a new family) but Cameron's actions do not substantiate it. Whether the writers did it to tease a ship doesn't really matter, as it still happened on the show. If the writers wanted to tease the House/Cameron ship, surely they are talented enough to have done so in other ways without having Chase question Cameron's motives and feelings regarding House. Also, I don't think it's true that if Chase were correct about Cameron's motivations, she would have ended the FWB arc. She was getting sex and enjoying herself, even if she didn't succeed in making House jealous. If Chase was still jealous of House in season 4, that's his problem. If she'd wanted to make House jealous, she would have stopped when he wasn't and when he was out of town and couldn't see. She didn't. Cameron's refusal to answer Chase's inquiry about whether she slept with House, in S4, mind you, certainly added to Chase's feelings of jealousy/insecurity. If she had been concerned about Chase's feelings and serious about her relationship with him (which had advanced beyond an FWB one by that time), then she would have wanted to squelch his misgivings. Since she chose instead to have the new team wonder about whether she had a "special" relationship with House, clearly Chase has reason to think House is more important to her than he is. You're right that it's Chase's problem. It's too bad for him because he deserves someone who appreciates him fully and thinks he's number one.

Cameron's refusal to answer Chase's inquiry about whether she slept with House, in S4, mind you, certainly added to Chase's feelings of jealousy/insecurity. If she had been concerned about Chase's feelings and serious about her relationship with him (which had advanced beyond an FWB one by that time), then she would have wanted to squelch his misgivings. Since she chose instead to have the new team wonder about whether she had a "special" relationship with House, clearly Chase has reason to think House is more important to her than he is. I disagree - Chase was entirely out of line to talk to her like that, and especially in front of the team. She wasn't willing to dignify it with a response and she was right to respond that way. (And apparently they hashed it out on their own, as was appropriate.)

I'm with 310Daisy on this. Of course Chase was wrong to bring it up when he did. But Cameron did not handle it well; her response made the whole incident even tackier. A mature adult would reply in such a way to neutralize the situation, not make it worse. The diplomatic, appropriate response would have been a quiet, gentle, "Let's talk about this later; it's private." But by making a shrewish face at Chase and telling him "It's none of their business; it's none of yours!" with more contempt than I've ever heard in her voice... well, she just made the whole thing worse. She humiliated her boyfriend and made an ass of herself. And the end result was that she kept the "did Cameron sleep with House" question open to speculation by everyone else.

At that point, Cameron was furious with both House and Cuddy (not without reason since she was getting targeted while Chase was getting off scot-free) and went to yell at House in the hyperbaric chamber. But that’s not what she said to House when she went to see him in the hyperbaric chamber. In fact, there was no mention of Chase at all. She seemed more interested in knowing what House wanted her to do. Cameron: My social life is my social life. House: Couldn’t agree more. What goes on in the privacy of a janitor’s closet is nobody’s business except – Cameron: She told me to end it. Is that what you want? House: I was actually hoping she’d fire one of you. At the end of the conversation House indicated that he wanted to go back to business when he asked for Emma’s MRI but Cam slammed the phone down and walked away in a typical display of unprofessional behavior because she probably realized that House didn’t care that she was sleeping with Chase. The diplomatic, appropriate response would have been a quiet, gentle, "Let's talk about this later; it's private." But by making a shrewish face at Chase and telling him "It's none of their business; it's none of yours!" with more contempt than I've ever heard in her voice... well, she just made the whole thing worse. She humiliated her boyfriend and made an ass of herself. And the end result was that she kept the "did Cameron sleep with House" question open to speculation by everyone else. Exactly. I agree with vitawash that he was out of line and didn’t deserve a response. But in addition to what she said, the look on Cam’s face made it seem like she was enjoying keeping the other’s guessing about the fact that she had slept with the genius boss. It took me back to the time when she triumphantly announced to everyone that she was going out on a date with House and that she was allowed to sexually harass her boss. And the time when she said “I am glad we never slept with each other” in front of Chase and Foreman when they announced to House that he had syphilis. And as always she didn't seem to realize that far from it making her seem important in other people's eyes, she was as you said simply making an ass of herself.

I think Chase humiliated himself in NNMNG. Cameron ignored him the first time, told him to keep quiet the second time and still he kept pushing. There was no way Cameron could have got away without making it public other than to ignore him; if she had said "no" it was airing her personal life in public; if she had said "we'll talk about it in private", it would have left the impression that there was something to talk about i.e. that she had had a relationship with House. Cam slammed the phone down and walked away in a typical display of unprofessional behavior because she probably realized that House didn’t care that she was sleeping with Chase. Everyone was behaving unprofessionally: House in going to Cuddy rather than speaking to them himself if he was concerned, as he is doing now with Foreman and Thirteen (he did it because he wanted to deflect Cuddy's attention from how he was screwing around with her patient not because he cared what they were doing); Cuddy for speaking to Cameron and not Chase and telling her to stop dating a colleague; and even Chase who was in there janitor's closet with her. Behaving unprofessionally is SOP on this show and Cameron had a right to be angry. (I've found Cuddy's behavior towards Cameron to be very unprofessional since season 2 but that's for another thread.) Yes, she asked what House hoped to accomplish by going to Cuddy. Maybe because she still wanted to know his reaction, certainly because he's her boss and if he had a problem with them, he should have handled it himself. It took me back to the time when she triumphantly announced to everyone that she was going out on a date with House and that she was allowed to sexually harass her boss. She told Foreman and Chase there was nothing special about the terms of her coming back. Then House told her in front of both of them not to tell them the terms and even after that she tried to say it was nothing. They kept asking her what it was, they wouldn't let it go and so she had to tell. If she hadn't it would have affected their working relationship, to think that she was getting a perk she refused to tell her colleagues about. The bit about sexually harassing her boss was a joke since that's what House does to Cuddy all the time.

She told Foreman and Chase there was nothing special about the terms of her coming back. Then House told her in front of both of them not to tell them the terms and even after that she tried to say it was nothing. They kept asking her what it was, they wouldn't let it go and so she had to tell. If she hadn't it would have affected their working relationship, to think that she was getting a perk she refused to tell her colleagues about. The bit about sexually harassing her boss was a joke since that's what House does to Cuddy all the time. If Cameron was so intent on keeping it to herself, she would have kept it to herself and told Foreman and Chase to f**k off. Hell, she could have even lied to them and said she got a new parking space or a free candy bar every week. Instead, she seemed quite pleased to tell them that she was going out with House. Excited, even.

The diplomatic, appropriate response would have been a quiet, gentle, "Let's talk about this later; it's private." But by making a shrewish face at Chase and telling him "It's none of their business; it's none of yours!" with more contempt than I've ever heard in her voice... well, she just made the whole thing worse. She humiliated her boyfriend and made an ass of herself. And the end result was that she kept the "did Cameron sleep with House" question open to speculation by everyone else. Chase embarrassed himself, and nothing Cameron did was going to change that. If I was as livid as she was because my boyfriend, from whom I would expect better (and honestly, I think part of their relationship is based on the idea that she can expect better from him now), was being incredibly rude, I don't think I'd be coming up with the polite, diplomatic response, either. She's not an automaton, she's a person. Maybe she overreacted, but Chase is not a patient and not a child, she doesn't owe it to him to be calm when he's acting like a jerk. It's not the best response, but I understand why she would respond that way. I sincerely doubt she was thinking about keeping the question open because "WTF is wrong with you now?" kind of becomes the more prominent issue at the moment. Nor do I see how the polite response actually keeps the question from being open. She's still not answering or clarifying anything, and it does, in fact, stay mysterious.

Actually, Cameron did say that when she said, "He caught us with your hand up my shirt. He's gotta have a reaction to that. You think that's what the vacation is?" She thought that House's vacation was a reaction to finding them half-naked in the closet...Clearly, she thought it was jealousy. I think most viewers just thought that House was taking his first vacation in years: The guy works hard, never misses a day of work, he's due for some time off, etc. Cameron made it all about Cameron. I don't think that it is 100% clear that Cameron thought House was jealous. Chase might have thought that but it doesn't mean he was right. Of course Cameron looked at the situation as how it related to her life, she was involved in the whole thing. The incident with von Leiberman is irrelevant to the incident with House catching Chase and Cameron in the closet. The situations are not even parallel. Furthermore, House perceived von Leiberman as having personally wronged him, and it was indicated that he was seeking vengeance only as a distraction from the pain of losing Stacy. (Hence the title of the episode, "Distractions.") By doing the deed at work, Chase and Cameron hadn't personally wronged House; they had simply behaved unprofessionally. As for House "basically Cameron's life to shreds"... I have no idea what you mean by that. House didn't even know Cameron back when she was married. And House didn't "discount" her relationship with her husband; he merely explained it. (It's really not that common for a 21-year-old to get married, especially if she has large career goals like becoming a doctor.) We've seen time and time again that House hold major grudges about things. Cameron and Chase got one over on him for awhile, they had a thing right under House's nose and kept it secret. We've seen how House reacts when he feels that someone got one over on him and it isn't pretty. I don't view epsiodes as points in time that don't relate to other episodes. Distractions is still part of the narrative, the Stacy situation is still part of the narrative. We saw over and over again how petty and evil he could be with people and I would assume that Chase and Cameron would realize this. He went out of his way to mess with Foreman when he thought he was leaving but never did anything from an administrative standpoint. If this was a completely equitable work environment where everone cared about everone else's feelings and things were done completely by the book from a human resources standpoint, I would agree but it seems to me that House waved goodby to a situation like that years ago. Cuddy and House (and to a lesser extent Wilson) are responsible for the poisonous environment in the diagnostics department. I can't take anything any of them say about propriety in the work place seriously because it is apparent, by this point, that House is going to do what he wants to do when he wants to do it. House let the situation with Cameron get out of control in Season 1. He could have stopped it at any time but he couldn't alter his behavior because that isn't who he is. That doesn't mean that it is ok for him to lash out at Cameron when they're at a nice place having dinner and he suddenly decides that she's getting too close. Cameron made her feelings known and he had no right to be that brutal with her. You just don't make those kind of comments about someone's dead spouse. One of the things I have never liked about House is that he doesn't seem to realize that everyone on the planet has issues, everyone has pain and scary parts of their lives that are every bit as real as his. I understand that he has issues but the more I think about it the more his arrogance in this respect seems so poisonous. She wasn't worried; she was hoping. After Cuddy confronted her about it, she went to the hyperbaric chamber to find House, in an attempt to engage him in a discussion about her new relationship. We've seen her be hopeful with House before and it never looked like what happened in that scene. In Act Your Age, he immediately went on the offensive and forced them to work together when it wasn't really needed. The writers on this show are among the best, and I trust them. Chase's reality is not everyone's, but as the writers did not write any words for Cameron that disputed Chase's, then we can conclude that Chase was right. So then, we can also conclude that Cameron was completely right when she said, in Season 1, that House needed to deal with his feelings for her? We can't take everything every character says at face value. If we did then we would have to conclude that Cameron is over House because she has said it numerous times. Of course they have grounds. They employ Chase and Cameron. Most workplaces in the U.S. have strict rules against sex in the workplace, whether you are on duty or not. For good reason. Chase and Cameron can do whatever they want on their own time in their own homes, but at PPTH, they are not to be indulging in sex. It's unethical and against the rules. Cuddy lets House get away with stuff that is against the rules all the time. They have created this environment by ignoring the feelings of staff so that House can basically do whatever he wants within his department. They're lucky that the ducklings were oddly devoted to House or Foreman or Cameron (or Chase) would be millionaires right now after a law suit and Cuddy and House would both be working at McDonald's. But all that has nothing to do with today, and House and Cuddy have never had sex within the walls of PPTH. So, again, that's neither parallel nor relevant to the Chase and Cameron situation. Cuddy let this situation fester for three years and never once did anything to force House to be more equitable or to deal with people in a more humane and respectful manner.

If Cameron was so intent on keeping it to herself, she would have kept it to herself and told Foreman and Chase to f**k off. Hell, she could have even lied to them and said she got a new parking space or a free candy bar every week. Instead, she seemed quite pleased to tell them that she was going out with House. Excited, even. Why should she have lied to them? To protect House? Given how he screws with them all for fun just because he can abuse his position as their boss to do it, he's the last person she should worry about protecting. To tell them to f**k off would have hurt their working relationship. These are the guys she spends her days and most of her nights with. She needs them to get her back and to make her workplace time pleasant. She didn't bounce in there saying "I got House to take me on a date". She said "same lousy job, same lousy salary". It was House who spilled the beans that there was something mysterious about her coming back. I wouldn't put him past it to do it deliberately to mess up her relationships with Chase and Foreman as some kind of payback (breaking his part of the deal), in which case he deserved her telling them.

I'm in the camp that thinks that Cameron was trying to make House jealous to some extent. I believe that statement about him HAVING to have a reaction to catching them together, plus going into the idea of him taking a vacation because of it shows that Cameron had a really over-inflated idea of where she ranked in House's world. At the same time, she knew she had a good thing with Chase, so why give it up just because it failed to get the reaction from House that she might have expected? There could have been more than one motive--getting House jealous AND having some fun. It doesn't have to be one or the other. Just because the one didn't work, it didn't mean she had to give up the other. It's not like sleeping with Chase was a chore. She obviously enjoys having sex with him which is why she propositioned him for FWB in the first place. I just don't even get the whole scene from NMMNG. Cameron said in front of Chase that she was glad she'd never slept with House. It makes no sense at all for him to suddenly question it just because they think House has an STD. That's one of the worst examples of writing the show has ever thrown at the audience. It didn't fit Chase to air his laundry in public and it didn't fit the show's own canon.

Chase embarrassed himself, and nothing Cameron did was going to change that. Yes, I did say that Chase was wrong to bring it up when he did. The point is, there is a right way and a wrong way to handle such a situation. If my boyfriend did something like that to me, I would have handled it with tact and class. I would have defused the situation rather than ignite it further. Cameron chose the classless route and managed to bring herself down into the gutter with Chase. They were both wrong, and I'm tired of Chase getting blamed for all that goes wrong in their relationship. I'm tired of being told that Cameron's behavior was acceptable because Chase brought up the issue first. They were both wrong, and Chase is not to blame for Cameron's overreaction. Cameron is an adult, and she should be able to behave like an adult.

Wait... you want characters on this show to behave like adults? :lol: See, that's why I hope they'll just keep Chase and Cameron together and happy. I want them to be the semi-functional counterpoint to the other couples on the show. That way they can concentrate on being doctors and doing doctory things. I don't want thier love life to be their focus because the writing for House/Cuddy has been SO bad and made both of those characters look SO bad that I don't wish to see that for Chase and Cameron.

Cameron chose the classless route and managed to bring herself down into the gutter with Chase. IMO, there was no way to handle it with class as long as Chase wouldn't drop it in public. It was a plot contrivance to remind people that there was a House/Cameron ship still without having it be Cameron obsessing over House. The episode was written by Shore and Hoselton. If anyone should get blamed for bad behaviour, it's them. :tritter: ITA with extra_cat on how bad the writing for House/Cuddy has been. I'm glad Cameron isn't a part of that.

I don't think that it is 100% clear that Cameron thought House was jealous. Chase might have thought that but it doesn't mean he was right. Of course Cameron looked at the situation as how it related to her life, she was involved in the whole thing. It's 100% clear to me. :wink: We've seen time and time again that House hold major grudges about things. Cameron and Chase got one over on him for awhile, they had a thing right under House's nose and kept it secret. We've seen how House reacts when he feels that someone got one over on him and it isn't pretty. But what on earth had Cam and Chase "got over on him"? Oh, they were sleeping together and keeping it from him? So what? That's not a personal affront to him. von Leiberman's actions were a personal affront to House. House was concerned about Chase and Cameron to the extent that it affected his department (work-life); it did not affect him in a personal way. Why on earth would he try to get "revenge" for something that didn't even affect him? I don't view epsiodes as points in time that don't relate to other episodes. Distractions is still part of the narrative, the Stacy situation is still part of the narrative. We saw over and over again how petty and evil he could be with people and I would assume that Chase and Cameron would realize this. Of course episodes relate to other episodes. But not everything is relevant to everything else. And I've never seen House as "petty" about anything; in fact, he lets things slide off his back a little too easily at times (e.g., 13 drugging and biopsying him, 13 slamming a laptop cover on his hand). I also don't find House "evil" at all, so maybe we just see House (and the show) in completely different ways. Cameron made her feelings known and he had no right to be that brutal with her. You just don't make those kind of comments about someone's dead spouse. What kind of comments? (That's rhetorical.) He said: You live under the delusion that you can fix everything that isn’t perfect. That’s why you married a man who was dying of cancer. You don’t love, you need. And now that your husband is dead, you’re looking for your new charity case. That’s why you’re going out with me. I’m twice your age, I’m not great looking, I’m not charming, I’m not even nice. What I am is what you need. I’m damaged. He didn't say anything horrifying about her husband; he actually didn't say anything about her husband except to mention that he was dying of cancer. His comments were focused on Cameron and her motives. One of the things I have never liked about House is that he doesn't seem to realize that everyone on the planet has issues, everyone has pain and scary parts of their lives that are every bit as real as his. I understand that he has issues but the more I think about it the more his arrogance in this respect seems so poisonous. That's interesting, because one of the things I love about House is that he realizes everyone has issues. He is always observing people and figuring out their motives, their pathologies, their interesting idiosyncrasies, etc. He is a student of human behavior, and he understands humanity far better than the average person. I've never seen him as arrogant in this respect. We've seen her be hopeful with House before and it never looked like what happened in that scene. In Act Your Age, he immediately went on the offensive and forced them to work together when it wasn't really needed. She had nothing of substance to gain by seeking him out and yelling at him in the hyperbaric chamber. She just wanted to engage him in a discussion. He didn't express any jealousy, so she came out of the encounter even angrier. In Act Your Age, he forced Chase and Cam to work together because they were fighting like little brats, and it was obnoxious. House, being the wise person that he is, knew that if they were alone together, they'd eventually come to some understanding. And he was right. So then, we can also conclude that Cameron was completely right when she said, in Season 1, that House needed to deal with his feelings for her? No, we can't conclude that, because House actually answered her and contradicted her: Cameron: You’re doing this because you can’t deal with your feelings for me. House: I believe that you are the only one to express feelings. Cuddy lets House get away with stuff that is against the rules all the time. Huge difference between the genius doctor doing what he needs to do in order to diagnose difficult illnesses and two young, horny doctors doing the deed all over the hospital. House's rule-breaking saves lives; Chase and Cam's frolicking was unprofessional, put a patient in danger (sleep lab), benefited nobody but themselves, and was downright gross and unsanitary.

But what on earth had Cam and Chase "got over on him"? Oh, they were sleeping together and keeping it from him? So what? That's not a personal affront to him. von Leiberman's actions were a personal affront to House. House was concerned about Chase and Cameron to the extent that it affected his department (work-life); it did not affect him in a personal way. Why on earth would he try to get "revenge" for something that didn't even affect him? House has never cared about how things affected his department, mostly because he isn't a very good administrator. There is a very thin (almost non-existant) line bettween what is personal and what is work related in his life. I just can't see him caring on a professional level about what was going on with Chase and Cameron. It seems that he doesn't really respect or even really value his subordinates in anyway other than as sounding boards and as people who can help him parse his therories. Again, if respect in the workplace was followed to letter, it wouldn't be an issue. Even people who work the night shift at gas stations have to take a three question test that reminds them not to make sexual comments, etc. House, from Season 1 on, completely ignored all of this so at best he's being selfish and at worst he's being extremely hypocritical. Of course episodes relate to other episodes. But not everything is relevant to everything else. And I've never seen House as "petty" about anything..I also don't find House "evil" at all, so maybe we just see House (and the show) in completely different ways. I thought the whole thing in Distractions was extremely petty. Not apologizing to Tritter and just letting that whole situation blow over was extremely petty and stupid. He didn't say anything horrifying about her husband; he actually didn't say anything about her husband except to mention that he was dying of cancer. His comments were focused on Cameron and her motives. Either everyone has to follow the rules of modern decency or no one does. Whether he was pointing out something about Cameron's motives or not, it was still wrong to go to jugular like that when earlier in the season she was still crying about the situation. Not only that, but it should have been obvious that PDH wasn't just the first in a long line of charity cases when he caught her crying over the whole situation by herself. He wouldn't even have known about it at all if it hadn't been for the fact that something shook her up at work and she went off by herself to be emotional about it. You can only really fault Cameron for not knowing House well enough to know that he would never respect any of her past relationships because he doesn't respect her. I don't think he's a bad person but he definately made a mistake in this particular situation. That's interesting, because one of the things I love about House is that he realizes everyone has issues. He is always observing people and figuring out their motives, their pathologies, their interesting idiosyncrasies, etc. He is a student of human behavior, and he understands humanity far better than the average person. I've never seen him as arrogant in this respect. He understands humanity through his particular filter. His reality isn't everyone's reality. He would be wrong more often than he is right if he didn't have people who checked his relentless misanthropy. The fact that he is often right on the show doesn't mean that he is always right. She had nothing of substance to gain by seeking him out and yelling at him in the hyperbaric chamber. She just wanted to engage him in a discussion. He didn't express any jealousy, so she came out of the encounter even angrier. In Act Your Age, he forced Chase and Cam to work together because they were fighting like little brats, and it was obnoxious. House, being the wise person that he is, knew that if they were alone together, they'd eventually come to some understanding. And he was right. One of the things the patriarchy is very good at is misdirecting women's anger. He used her personal life as his personal toy to mess around with at work. Chase backed him up by assuming she was jealous. Cameron was never allowed to explain what was going on, both Chase and House made their pronouncments and then got to control every aspect of the situation after that. House shouldn't be allowed to control Cameron's life. If he had any issues he should have fired them both. His own personal problems wouldn't allow him to do that, instead he did things his way. Huge difference between the genius doctor doing what he needs to do in order to diagnose difficult illnesses and two young, horny doctors doing the deed all over the hospital. House's rule-breaking saves lives; Chase and Cam's frolicking was unprofessional, put a patient in danger (sleep lab), benefited nobody but themselves, and was downright gross and unsanitary. He broke into the psychiatrists office and stole files. He didn't even get suspended. He forged scrips and Cuddy lied for him. Neither House nor Cuddy have a leg to stand on.

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